Vic Border unprotected

It's not if, but when EFI gets into Victoria

The border is unprotected!

The Hume Highway, Australia's busiest Highway, is not secure despite what you see on TV. The security guards are in paddocks behind locked gates and have no lighting. You simply drive past and then you can take what ever exit you like once your just past the "Paddock"

At the legal speed limit of 110 kph in the dark, the guards wouldn't even see you!

At Mildura, I personally watched the guard look the other way, and then the other way when the "float" went past.

It's a worry, and our tax dollars are not being spent effectively

Ian Metherall

Who cares about my little pony

ts just a little pony, not racehorse, not really any value but she has been in are family from six months of age she is now seventeen and in foal with just two weeks to go. She didn’t ask to be infected with possible e.i., she has all the signs. I am in an infected area Logan Village, my vet says it could be, the dpi say it could be and it has all the signs that it could be.

But is it, she is being treated for e.i. but no tests have been done to put my mind at rest because no vet or dpi person has seen my poor little pony. I realise I am not the only person on this planet but come on this is crazy WHAT DO I TELL PEOPLE IT COULD BE E.I. WE WILL JUST HAVE TO WAIT AND SEE.
LEWIS

Ipswich Show grounds Saturday 6th October 2007 1.00pm

Ipswich Show grounds Saturday 6th October 2007 1.00pm

This is your chance to show the State and Federal Government that we are a united group of caring horse owners who need answers and help.

Phil

What Is The AUSVETPLAN?

“Australia’s response to a range of emergency animal diseases is captured in a series of technical and scientific response manuals called AUSVETPLAN”.

Given that the debate regarding to vaccinate or not to vaccinate is hotting up, it seem a good time to explain very briefly what is contained in the AUSVETPLAN regarding the outbreak of EI.

“In terms of EI, the Ausvetplan states that vaccination will not be used if an EI outbreak is detected early and can be confidently contained by effective movement controls. However Ausvetplan recognises that vaccination may be appropriate where:

The disease is widespread when detected; or,

Significant numbers of horses are at immediate risk; or,

Initial control methods have failed, and the disease has spread beyond the original restricted area and is likely to become endemic in the general equine population.

AUSVETPLAN identifies the following strategies for the use of vaccination in the face of an outbreak:

Mass vaccination – this would involve widespread vaccination of horses to build up herd immunity.

Ring vaccination – vaccination is carried out locally in a ring around identified sources of infection to limit further spread by producing an immune buffer.

Predictive vaccination – this targets enterprises and populations that could be expected to contribute most to future spatial transmission of infection.

Advantages of Vaccination.
Vaccination can prevent clinical disease.
Vaccination reduces the susceptibility of at risk horses, reduces severity of clinical signs and the level of viral shedding if they become infected.
Vaccination can reduce farm to farm infection.
Apart from horse movements to New Zealand, there are unlikely to be any international implications of vaccinating.

Disadvantages of Vaccination.
Vaccination may mask clinical signs, so vaccinated horses will need to be identified and monitored for evidence of infection.
Serological monitoring will be difficult, even though tests are available to differentiate vaccinated horses. Some tests used in this respect may not be internationally validated.
The movement of sub-clinically infected, vaccinated horses, may spread infection to previously unaffected areas.
Vaccination may prolong the need for movement restrictions, because it may slow the transmission and spread of infection within areas.
Vaccinating selected regions will lead the country being separated into free and vaccinated areas. This will result in the differential movement requirements and the need for infrastructure (permits, border control etc.) to maintain integrity of free areas.
Vaccination will have an impact in terms of registration and passport issues and the practical control measures required before many horse events can proceed.
Vaccination is not an immediate option, it will take time to import vaccine (permit process), deploy vaccine and train vaccinators, vaccinate the population, for immunity to develop.
In the case of the recombinant (canary pox) vaccine there may be restrictions placed on how and who may use the vaccine.
Vaccination may affect performance in the short term.
Vaccine use is likely to extend the duration of the outbreak and delay ability to declare freedom”.

This table was produced by the Consultative Committee on Emergency Animal Diseases on the 13th September.

It really does look as if the CCEAD are throwing all they have into the NO vote for vaccination. The advantages sound pretty good though. There is not doubt that no flu vaccination gives 100% immunity, but reasonable immunity is better than none surely?

Much of the above “disadvantages” is old news now, but it is worth examining some of the disadvantages.
Identifying and monitoring vaccinated horses can surely not be that great a problem. Most horses are registered with some organisation or other, even foals.

Testing whether a horse is positive because it is vaccinated and positive because it is sick with EI cannot be that difficult and if it is, there are tests to determine one from the other.

With some talk of restrictions still being in place next Easter, it is hard to imagine that a vaccination regime would be slower that that. It is hard to see how vaccination would extend the outbreak.

The canary pox recombinant vaccine is genetically modified and will not be accepted in WA and Tasmania, as veterinarian Denis Goulding explained last week. Denis also pointed out that and inactivated vaccination would be needed for horses to travel to Europe.

How much training does a veterinarian need to administer a vaccination?

Like humans after a vaccination, they may feel a bit off colour for a day or two, but any affect is very short term.

One argument against vaccination that appears again and again is that blanket vaccination does not prevent EI outbreaks and there are many examples of the outbreaks in Europe etc. But as has been discussed at some length in the article in the current issue of Horse Deals, entire countries are not shut down, and they are only little countries. If there is an outbreak in France they still have shows in Germany and Italy and that is because the horses are vaccinated. In 1992 there was an outbreak amongst the horses stabled at the Hong Kong Jockey Club. 37% of the 955 horses contracted the virus. Given the very close confines horses are stabled in Hong Kong, it would seem, whilst 37% would not please the vaccine producers it is a lot better than 100% which was the case at Randwick. And one would presume that the 37% did not suffer a serious bout. This statistic can be used for either argument.

However, eradication is by far the best way to go if it can be achieved.

Reference material.

National Management Group Communique 13th September.
Biosecurity Victoria ‘Vaccination Strategies for Equine Influenza’ Discussion Document.

Horse flu: Assistance Program Rolled out in Qld

05 October 2007

An extensive network of support services is being rolled out across South East Queensland to provide assistance to people affected by the equine influenza outbreak.
The Department of Communities has opened one-stop shops on the Gold Coast and in Toowoomba to support to individuals and families whose livelihoods are under threat.

Read more.

Excuse me Tim Roberts, what was that you said?....

In reply to
FYI - Vaccine makes us laughing stock: Vet

Is it any wonder Mr Roberts lost his credibility, have you read his document called


'A MEANS TO CONTAIN AND ERADICATE “EQUINE INFLUENZA” FROM AUSTRALIA'

If not, try this link

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:e3Yy12pf-VgJ:pepper.server101.com/downloads/means_to_cont.doc+%27A+MEANS+TO+CONTAIN+AND+ERADICATE+%E2%80%9CEQUINE+INFLUENZA%E2%80%9D+FROM+AUSTRALIA%27&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3


An extract from the above document:


Proposed CISI Policy
Containment, Isolation and Selective Inoculation Policy (CISI) is a modification to the current containment policy, under which the horse industry in Australia will be able to resume relatively normal business within 21 days of implementation. However, there will be some constraints (The Containment Area must remain quarantined from rest of Australia until cleared of EI) but normal business should be able to resume within the Containment Zone with immediate effect. At the same time eradication is attainable.

For CISI to work, the authorities and industry participants will need to disregard state borders (as being the containment zones), and treat the containment zone in New South Wales and Queensland as one and the same.

CISI Policy only becomes viable because of the live recombinant vector vaccine. In this vaccine the Canarypox virus carries the EI virus antigents. (ProteqFlu). The principal of this vaccine is that the EI component of this vaccine is inactivated and only selected genes from the EI virus into live infectious but non disease causing Canarypox Virus.

The CISI policy is simple to apply, unlikely to fail and economically viable and the one most likely to get the whole NSW and Queensland horse industries back into full operational mode in the shortest period possible. We must be reminded that one of the biggest employers in both NSW and Queensland is on its knees.If the currently proposed zonal vaccination program fails we would have a devastating setback and could even push the industry over the brink.
.....and now he's saying


"We are the laughing stock of the world over this," Roberts told the Sydney Morning Herald."Why do we have to use the genetically modified vaccine?"Roberts claims Australia has been far too slow in responding with any effective measures and maintained the use of "killed" vaccine would have been a much better option.

Well butter my butt and call me a biscuit! Excuse me for thinking he's tooting his own horn, its hard enough to sort out the wheat from the chaff in this nightmare and if self proclaimed experts go changing their views so radically one has to become cynical as to their own agenda. Try Googling his name and see who his big clients are....


Three cheers for Heath Ryan while I'm here!!!


Cindy M
SE Qld

Inequity

Can anyone tell me why Gerry Harvey (from Harvey Norman fame) is able to move his thoroughbred (racehorse) broodmares from his Broombee stud in Armidale (currently a red zone surrounded by active EI outbreaks and quarantined properties) to his Barrimal stud in the Hunter? I am told this is without a permit or testing of the mares!

This outbreak has been handled so badly and inequitably that its value as a learning experience for future management of contagious disease outbreaks would be farcial.

To every horse owner out there - you have every right to be outraged.

Some heads need to roll!!!!!!!!!!

LB

Re Horse Flu

With no help from the Govt. little Johhny Howard & his strange group of members. This Govt. caused this flu, by not being careful enough, an now they are not interested in helping us. The race horses get attention but we are all forgotten. Why in the bloody hell, don’t we get help, our horses are our life.

WE SHOULD BE OUT THERE COMPETING & YES THAT WRITER IS QUITE RIGHT (WE ARE LIKE SITTING DUCKS ) message to little Johnny, you need to give someone else a go your to boring 15yrs is to much.

ANOTHER DEATH

My condolances go out to Vic Gough Traing Stables for the loss of one of their preformance horses
last night due to EI SOMETHING THAT SOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED. Remember everybody
meeting at Ipswich Showgrounds 1pm Saturday 6th Ocotober.

Ang
Roar Don't Whisper!!!!

Victorian concerns

Recreational/ Performance horse owners in Victoria should be concerned that horses such as Leica Falcon, Takeover Target and Natural Destiny may be allowed to come to Victoria and take part in the Spring Racing Carnival.

The Victorian recreational and performance sectors of the Horse Industry have supported the efforts of the DPI by voluntarily confining our horses and cancelling events (at great expense for many individuals and not for profit clubs and organizations) to help keep EI out of Victoria.

Hundreds of thousands of dollars (of our money) is being spent on border security to keep horses out of Victoria.

By considering allowing any horse into Victoria from an EI infected area makes an absolute mockery of what we have all voluntarily worked so hard to achieve. This not only compromises the whole equestrian industry in our State but brings into question the integrity of the people who are pleading with us to uphold the current stringent biosecurity measures.
Judy Ogden

Vaccine poured on ground in QLD.

This morning I met my horsey neighbour up the main street, (we all liveabout 5 klms from town) quite by accident and he happened to mention thatALL his horses AND ponies got vaccinated recently!

This was of course a big surprise to me as I thought they were only doingracehorses?! But Standardbreds AND his pet ponies ( about 10 of them) and weare NO WHERE near the buffer zone! What!?? How??! Why!!???You will also imagine that I was amazed when he told me that they hadvaccine left over and weren't allowed to take it off the property! Why? Heis obviously clean and un infected or they wouldn't be vaccinating him, sothey poured the vaccine on the ground!!I am also more upset because I have applied for high risk vaccine ( no yes/noreply yet) and if they say no then I will know that my sick horses vaccinewas poured on the ground. My horse has had very bad pneumonia and has severescarring of respiratory tract and lungs and is EXTREMELY high risk.

I live in Woodford surrounded by 2 racehorse properties, (breeeding andracing) and the Standardbred place.

I need to go and have a cuppa and calm down because to say I am nearhysterical is an understatement.!cheersSharon

Pony Rides in Adelaide

I'm just wanting to know why are pony rides allowed to continue to operate in top tourist spots like Glenelg etc where we are inundated with tourists from all over Australia when all other (except racing of course) equestrian sports are at a standstill!!

Josie

Thank you Heath

For being a voice of reason in this whole EI saga.

We need more people to stand up and be heard over the din of doom mongers and hand ringers.

We can all beat this if we work together and stop being victims.

Support each other, ring our regular farriers and horse workers and see how you can help them too.

Joan McSpadden

Coming out the other side.

This epidemic will pass and there needs to be some plan for coming outthe other side. There is plenty of doom and gloom on all the web sitesand the focus is on the pain and anguish. The disease and itscomplications have and will cause a lot of hardship some devastating. NSW has reported to date some 30,000 infected horses and most of these will be on the mend within a month or so.

We are in the purple zone have four who are now recovering after four weeks. We will take it slowly and are hopeful to be back in the dressag earena over the next month.

I believe we need some leadership and a more positive outlook there does not seem to be any plan as to how we manage and plan recovery. The EFA,Dressage NSW, Pony Club NSW are who I would like to see trying toestablish some positive steps to recovery. The getting back into action is best thing that we can do for thosedependant on horses for an income. I would hope by November we should see the resumption of activity in the Purple zone with low key may be supervised activity.

Events for horses who have recovered will be ahuge boost to morale as well stem the financial strain.I think the NSW Dressage should consider getting training days going at Claredon ASAP with DPI approval. November maybe. There is norestriction on movement within the Purple zone and I think there will be enough horses recovered so as not to put them at risk. Care needs to betaken not to bring the horses on too early and I think a vet check prior to commencing training would be good advice, this should remain anindividual responsibility.

It would not be very safe for uninfected horses to attend but there is no safety in the Purple zone for the many way. Pony Club may be a tougher nut as there is less structure and many committees, opinions, to negotiate. Unless there is some guidance by the PCNSW committee I would put it in the too hard basket.

Unfortunately the DPI did and have not put in place any registration ofhorses identification or established and data base of horses who havehad the flu so from a management point of view they will never knowwhich horse is has some immunity. I suggest even the 30,000 who have hadthe flu will need to be vaccinated if it is deemed the way to go.

What awaste!

Regards, Rodney Butler

What About Bushfires?

Julie Currie from Macquarie Park Arabians at The Oaks in NSW wrote to the Blog with concern regarding what to do in the advent of bushfire, given that she was at the time engulfed in a smoke haze. Julie has 13 horses on the property, which is in the Red Zone and movement is not permitted. Julie rang the DPI but could not get through.

Horse Deals assured Julie that we would make every effort to get through to the NSW DPI and ask what the protocol was given a bushfire. We rang the DPI number published in the current edition of Horse Deals at about 11am this morning and after a short wait of about seven minutes, we were third caller in line, we got through.

“In the event of a bushfire, logic prevails in sustaining life. You move the horses and get out of there. Ideally move as little distance as possible and if you are in a Red Zone, Purple Zone etc., try and stay in that Zone. When you have reached safety you must then apply retrospectively for a permit to move from the Rural Lands Protection Board. www.rlpb.org.au

Vaccination of Racehorses Has Little to do with the Health of the Horses - Done to Protect Racing.

Continue to Voice our Frustration - " NSW Minister Macdonald and his staff have received over 1,000 emails and many phone calls expressing opposition to what is seen as favouritism for the racing sector" We can make a difference!
Found this on a TB Website this morning.........

AHIC aggrieved

AUSTRALIA - The Australian Horse Industry Council – an umbrella organization representing all sectors of the equine community including the thoroughbred industry – says an increasing number of horse owners are aggrieved at perceived preferential treatment given to the thoroughbred sector.
“We do not see why racehorses are allowed to travel up to 5km daily in amber zones to a racetrack when other horses are not allowed to move 500 metres to a different paddock,” AHIC stated.
However, the AHIC said in a statement today that despite increasing challenges as ‘state argues against state, minister against minister and racing versus everyone else” it believed that with 100 per cent support and compliance, the prospects of eradicating EI were good.
“If you live in NSW or Queensland you might be suffering movement restrictions, loss of income, sick horses and numerous other complications from our first big encounter with an exotic disease,” it told members.
“If you live in Victoria, Tasmania, South Australia you might want all movements in NSW and Qld restricted to ensure that the disease does not spread southwards.“
“The disease control efforts are … a compromise between getting things back to normal as soon as possible and removing all risk that the disease will spread further.”
“We know that all horses are equally susceptible to EI and that the value that owners place on their horses does not equate to their purchase price.
Therefore, we understand the extreme anger that has been generated among horse owners as vaccines are allocated by political decisions to protect racehorses before non-racing horses,” AHIC said.
“We have conveyed this sense of frustration to NSW Minister Macdonald. He and his staff have received over 1,000 emails and many phone calls expressing opposition to what is seen as favouritism for the racing sector. Despite this the NSW Government still gives support in decision making and financial support to the racing sector,” it said.
“The reality is that racing has a much greater political and media pull than other horse interests. The average punter and voter have more interest in racing than in what the recreational horse riders do with their horses,” the AHIC said.
The AHIC has to be even handed about horse industry problems… the disruption of the racing sector has a great economic impact. The vaccination of racehorses has little to do with the health of the horses. It is being done to protect racing. Yes, it is all about money. The horse industry is a very big employer and generates economic benefit. Therefore if we wish to limit the economic impact of EI, racing has to have a priority,” AHIC maintained.
“But if the thoroughbred industry is to be protected, the disease must be controlled in the general horse population. The ongoing containment and control of EI depends on disease control in non racing horses which represent at least 80 per cent of the total population. We strongly support the NSW and QLD decisions to make vaccination of buffer zones the highest priority. The horses in the buffer zones are overwhelmingly non racing horses.
“The thoroughbred racing and breeding interests have enjoyed advantages such as earlier release from movement restrictions, earlier vaccination and potentially earlier release from quarantine control.
“The AHIC continues to argue for these freedoms to be granted to the wider population.”
AHIC says it would like to see the extension of purple zones so that other breeds can move their mares to stallions as has been allowed for thoroughbreds.
“Many breeders will go broke if their breeding operations are halted. Luckily most breeds can start to serve in October with little economic loss – this is a more rational start to the breeding season as has been recognised by Standardbred breeders.
“We do realise that creation of more purple zones or the widespread use of vaccine may delay an area being removed from quarantine because it may be harder to prove freedom from infection.
“We also hear of discrepancies between controls being implemented differently in different states. Since early in the outbreak NSW horses have been allowed to move to a veterinary hospital for welfare reasons. In Queensland these movements have been restricted.
“Movements and horse events are now allowed in green zones subject to conditions imposed by the DPI. These areas will be extended as red and amber zones shrink with successful containment.”

Maureen

Berry/Kiama EI Meetings

Equine Influenza – Important meetings called for all horseowners.

The Department of Primary Industry has called two meetings to discuss equine influenza in the Shoalhaven and Kiama region.

The first meeting will be held at the Berry Bowling Club on Tuesday 9^th October from 5.30pm – 7.30pm and a further meeting will be held on Saturday 13^th October at the Kiama Bowling Club between 2.30pm and 5.30pm.

There will be a presentation by the Department of Primary Industry (DPI) about Equine Influenza and the regulations regarding horse movements within our region, with special emphasis on the zone between Kiama and Nowra

All horseowners are encouraged to attend, so they can find out the correct and up to date information regarding this serious threat.

For more information please call the Department of Agriculture at Berry on 4464 6000.

Belinda

No decision on horse flu vaccine for Tas

Talks between Tasmanian racing industry and government representatives have broken up without a decision being made on equine influenza vaccinations.
The state remains free of the disease, but a ban on horses entering the state is due to be lifted on October the 15th.

The Tasmanian Thoroughbred Racing Council says thousands of Victorian horses have been innoculated with a vaccine containing genetically modified material, but such material is prohibited under state laws.

The council's Rohan Mitchell says today's meeting didn't resolve the issue of whether these horses will be allowed into the state for the annual racing carnivals.

Read more.

Horse owners urged to keep reporting EI

Horse owners in purple zones in the Upper Hunter and Richmond areas are being urged to continue reporting horses displaying flu-like symptoms.

“While most people are doing the right thing and reporting sick horses we are still receiving tip offs that some horse owners are not reporting the illness,” NSW chief veterinary officer, Bruce Christie, said today.

“This is a legal responsibility of horse owners under the Exotic Diseases Act and is vital to stop any further spread of equine influenza (EI).

“Failure to report could have widespread and serious implications in terms of the eradication program.”

The maximum penalty for not reporting an ill horse is $22,000 and possible jail.
Clinical signs of EI include a deep dry hacking cough, a watery nasal discharge that may become cloudy or coloured, a sudden increase in temperature, depression, loss of appetite, laboured breathing, muscle pain and muscle stiffness.

Report ill horses to the NSW DPI hotline on 1800 675 888.

Meantime, it is essential for breeders to get their horses into the purple zones by midnight October 18.

“A permit system now in place allow stallions and mares to move into purple restricted areas for horse industry mating programs,” Mr Christie said.

The horses will stay inside the zone until the movement restrictions are lifted.

Zoning is a central component of the NSW Equine Influenza Protection Plan and provides greater flexibility across the State, allowing essential breeding to take place.

“The strategic zones are helping contain and eradicate the disease, while also allowing some movement of mares and foals to help the breeding and racing industries survive.”

Scone leads campaign to clean-up horse flu

More than 54 horse trucks and trailers have been decontaminated at the Scone Regional Saleyards with NSW Department of Primary Industries (DPI) staff on site to assist in the team effort to clean-up equine influenza (EI).

Scone has become an important part of the EI eradication plan with the establishment of a horse transport decontamination site.

NSW DPI has commended horse owners and transport companies who are taking positive steps to prevent the spread of EI by showering and cleaning vehicles, equipment and clothing.
NSW chief veterinary officer, Bruce Christie, said vehicles which transported horses into the purple zone are required to undergo thorough disinfection before leaving the zone.
“We have set up the site to expedite the decontamination process and are pleased people are taking the biosecurity arrangements seriously,” he said.

“Once they have cleaned their vehicles and showered they are changing into clean clothes before they leave the site.”

John Howard are you paying any attention?

Could one of John Howards helpers just tap him on the shoulder and ask him How BLOODY bad does this have to get?People are loosing thier horses and all because your useless government department stuffed up and let EI in.I for one have had enough as I am sure a lot of other people have .IF you have a heart or any compassion PLEASE DO SOMETHING .

This is no longer something that will just go away.You can not have one state having a spring racing carnival when there are horses dying in another state.There are hard working people (TAX PAYERS) out there that will and are well on thier way to loosing the lot.These people put you in charge wake up JOHNNY.

From another sitting duck

Info Needed

I was wondering if anyone out there is having trouble with their dogs coughing.....
We have 6 horses that have EI and you know what dogs are like eating poo etc.........
My dog never coughed before this only started when the horses came down with EI
Kaz

IT’S TIME TO STEP UP AND HELP OUR FRIENDS & NEIGHBOURS!

Many things that Heath says in his discussion regarding EI with Horse Deals recently (4th October) seem so close to the mark it is a bit scary especially having to wait this disease out. In reality though, WHAT DO WE DO FOR ALL THE BATTLERS WHO ARE FIGHTING TO STAY AFLOAT AT THE MOMENT?? Does anyone have any thoughts on what we can do to help out so many of the people who are hurting at the moment especially the ones who seem to be “falling through the cracks” (i.e. non-EFA registered horses ineligible for funding for example) in this particular crisis? What worries me is some individuals are already starting to talk about shooting their horses. We can not let people get to this point of desperation! The problem though is that most non-horsey people think of this industry as a luxury that most others can not afford. What many of these people do not realise is that for many of us it’s a LIFESTYLE CHOICE. Quite often it means going without other necessities of life (such as trips to the dentist, etc.!).

The EFA and other types of horse organisations do not seem to be doing much for many of the non-elite owner/riders so is it feasible to start thinking about our own grassroots fundraising for so many of these people that are in dire straits? How feasible would it be to approach one of the big banks and discuss trying to get a fund started to help cover costs for families that are having trouble feeding their animals? It would be designed much like Drought Relief, etc. Another idea would be to keep it a more local thing and have local Pony Clubs or local riding clubs do something like what the Boy Scouts have done in the past to raise money by doing odd jobs as a type of fundraising. All the kids are bored to death at the moment (including my child) and probably would love to have some sort of project that would help others and help keep them involved in the horse world even if they are not able to ride.

I know that my farrier is barely staying afloat at the moment and that at least one saddlery has closed its doors in our area and they are both in the green zone of NSW! I am sure that this is partly because they are very close to both red and amber zones and much of their business has come from those areas in the past. I am sure the other reason is that because no one is competing they are not buying or using the services of equine professionals.

Does anyone out there have any thoughts on this as it is only going to get worse not better for most areas of NSW and QLD? Some DPI personnel are saying it may be Easter of 2008 before this disease burns itself out. What state of decay will much of the Australian Horse Industry be in by then? So perhaps it is time to start thinking about how we are going to keep this industry afloat especially if we are looking at another 3 or more months down the road? I am ready to put my time and effort (some money!) to helping do this but unsure where to start. Let’s start tossing some ideas out there so a plan can begin to come together.

Cathy

I'm hearing ya!

Like Heath says, we need to be patient because the ultimate outcome and by far the best case scenario is to get rid of it!

Jodi Homer